Late last November, Hans Schmidt, a 26-year-old former military combat medic who is married with two small children, was preaching the gospel in the public square in Glendale, Arizona, when a car pulled up near him and shot him in the head. He told ABC15 News in a new report:
“I remember falling to my knee. And then after that, I was like, ‘Oh, something’s not right. I grabbed all my gear, put it back in the car. I drove my car back to church.”
Upon arrival, he went to tell his wife what happened, but no words would come out. His wife Zulya shared:
“He just, like, comes to the car and, like, I remember just seeing, like blood. And I’m like, ‘What happened? What happened?'”
Sensing something was deeply wrong, but unsure of the exact nature of his injuries- not even knowing that he was shot in the head at this point. Zulya and her brother decided to take Schmit to the hospital. He started seizing while in the vehicle and arrived at the hospital unresponsive. He was placed on life support and in a medically induced coma, with everyone believing he was going to pass away.
Prayers came from saints across the world, and a month later, he spoke for the first time. A month after that, in late January, he walked out of the hospital with bullet fragments still lodged in his brain after the neurosurgeon decided that surgery was too risky to remove them all.
“I should not be alive, realistically, I should be dead. And because (of) His grace and love, I’m still here.”
Though he’s still in recovery, Schmidt says he’s eager to get back to work, and doctors say he’ll be able to lead a mostly normal life. The long-term and short-term effects of the brain damage he suffered are unclear and have not been shared publicly.
Even knowing that the person who fired the gun is still out there, Hans is back at the corner of 51st and Peoria avenues, ready to share his new testimony.
“I don’t think that holding a grudge against him is going to change anything,” Hans said. “I think it’s important to forgive people. And I forgive him.”
Following our reporting that exposed Logos Bible Software as hosting, selling, and making available thousands of erotic books through their platform, a representative from the company shared that they are “actively in the midst of a large-scale cleanup” and are asking for patience while they cull these books from their platform.
Two weeks ago, we revealed in a series of posts that Logos Bible Software , perhaps the world’s most prominent and popular sermon prep and bible study software endorsed by everyone from John MacArthur to Beth Moore, was selling books containing graphic and descriptive sex scenes rivaling the most sordid and smuttiest of Harlequins. These were found on their Logos website, Faithlife E-Books site, and the app itself, and often involved hosting the catalog of Erotic or LGBTQ-affirming book publishers.
What we found particularly vexatious was the fact that they were alerted of this over a month ago by a long-term customer and did not act in a manner befitting the urgency of the situation. They removed a dozen books, yet thousands remained.
Once we got involved, however, they acted immediately, initially explaining that “they were removing these and related titles ASAP”
Thank you for bringing this to our attention. We agree this has no place in the Christian faith. These resources do not align with our philosophy and are from an automated feed from the publisher—we are actively addressing this process and removing these and related titles ASAP.
Matt Bennett, Content of VP products, posted an update to their forum, writing in part:
…Many of you have noted, a difficulty in broadening the content available on logos.com is that we rely on publishers to provide relevant, helpful content that doesn’t violate our standards of containing erotic/graphic language or inciting violence. (You can read our entire distribution philosophy here.) Many Bible-focused, respected publishers add books to the Logos platform using an automated feed. Some of these publishers have imprints that publish books which sometimes violate our standards—and these imprints also send books to the Logos platform using the automated feed. We’ve always used BISAC codes to filter out as many of these books as we can and we take down individual titles as we find them.
However, we’re currently working to tighten these controls so the Logos platform is always a safe place for going deeper in the Bible. A few things that means going forward:
We have turned off the automatic feed for publishers and publishing imprints with multiple titles that violate our distribution philosophy. This means that titles from these publishers will be reviewed to ensure nothing erotic/graphic or violent makes it to our website.
Our team will review titles flagged by users like you within one business day. If a title violates our standards against erotic, graphic, or violent language, we will remove it ASAP. You can send questionable titles to titlereview@logos.com to be reviewed by someone at Logos.
We apologize for the few resources that have bypassed our filtering system in the past. Thank you to those who have brought them to our attention so we could immediately remove them, and thank you for continuing to trust Logos to help you go deeper in your study of Scripture.
This was followed up with a post a few days later:
While we are grateful for these efforts and satisfied with Protestia’s role in completely altering how Logos curates and selects content, some aspects of this situation remain irksome and troubling.
Despite sending Logos multiple requests for comment for the last two weeks, through phone, email, and private chat, they have ignored all our overtures. Of course, we’re not owed anything, and their silence is completely their prerogative, but even some acknowledgment and a “no comment” would have been welcome and appreciated.
Furthermore, Bennett says, “We apologize for the few resources that have bypassed our filtering system in the past.” This minimizes the scope of the problem. It was not a “few” resource, but rather THOUSANDS, magnified because the same books were available on multiple platforms. Some of our data, which we received by scraping the site, has revealed as many as 4000 erotic and pornographic books, an estimated 3-4% of their total content, so let’s not play games with these numbers and pretend this is a small lapse of a couple of books that just so happened to get through.
If it were a few books, you’d have it solved by now, but you don’t, so it’s not.
Then there is the fact that at the time of writing, hundreds/ thousands of filthy books remain on the site, including many that have fully nude women on the front covers.
Logos has now had six weeks to clean things up, including two weeks with an extra dose of pressure; how much longer do they need? Another month? Six months? What sort of resources and manpower are being allocated to this problem? Are we going to be here at Christmas flagging Logos’ content because they can’t get their act together? Why are we blurring explicit content that pastors and laypeople might stumble upon six weeks after the fact? (Book blurs below added by us)
Logos insists that titles from some publishers will be “reviewed to ensure nothing erotic/graphic or violent makes it to our website,” but what of the troublesome, non-sexual content that does NOT violate Logo’s publication prerogatives?
Logos says ” If a title violates our standards against erotic, graphic, or violent language, we will remove it ASAP” Given that this does not seem to contain any of those things, does this mean it’s safe for sale and will not be removed? How many more titles are like this that will not be pulled? Why hasn’t it been pulled yet?
Responding to questions over why Logos did not deal with the original complainant, ghosting the person and causing us to step in, Kristen Tetteh, the Director of Customer Experience who did not respond to our multiple request for follow-up, shared:
We want to thank the user who initially flagged this for us. We missed replying to his request for follow up and wish we hadn’t. When we were contacted we took quick action to remove the titles we were alerted to. We desire to provide all of our users with high quality care and view this as an important learning moment for us.
This is not true. They removed some of the flagged titles from the Logos page, but they did not remove other titles when they were originally contacted, including the aforementioned titles. They were provided with links, and they still did nothing.
They did not take quick action to remove the books because if they did, they wouldn’t still be on two of their three platforms. The notion or suggestion that they were on this six weeks ago, treating the removal of books with the urgency it demands and simply missed a follow email about progress, is a fairy-tale.
So here’s what we see: a company squandering the good graces and benefit of the doubt we are trying to afford it. Tons of filthy books and content remain, particularly in the app, which, on account of its search capabilities, picks up X-rated resources alongside bible commentaries and biblical treatises.
Logos’ response remains disappointing, and for this reason, we would not use these resources (nor would we let our children) until we are confident we’re not going to get a naked breast on a book cover or get a glimpse of a graphic sex scene while looking up scriptural references.
In some disheartening news, Pastor Alistair Begg has doubled down on his insistence that Christians can attend LGBTQ weddings and even buy the couple a gift, according to the leadership of American Family Radio, resulting in Begg’ show being terminated from the lineup.
Begg, who pastors Parkside Church in Cleveland, Ohio, and whose program Truth for Life has aired on AFR for the last 12 years, sent representatives to speak on his behalf to AFR Vice President Ed Vitagliano and AFA Vice President Walker Wildmon. The results, they shared, were discouraging:
Taking over the timeslot previously occupied by Truth for Life to speak directly to Begg’s audience, AFR leadership said they contacted the pastor to give him “an opportunity to say ‘I messed up right there'” and to provide him with the opportunity to say ‘I said the wrong thing, and I’d like to recant,'” but that no apology or clarification was forthcoming:
The two individuals that we talked with, Walker and I with two individuals from Alistair Begg’s ministry, they made it clear that Alistair Begg believes that homosexuality is wrong, he hasn’t changed that his views on that. He does not believe that homosexual marriage is valid and that the practice of homosexual activity is, as the Bible says, an abomination.
So all four of us were in agreement with that. But what we could not get them to change, and they said that Alistair Begg is not going to change his mind, was on the issue of whether Christians should attend.
…And the goal of the call, and the goal of all Christians when approaching these issues, should be reconciliation, but reconciliation in truth. And so that was our goal with the call with Alistair Begg’s team and unfortunately we didn’t get there. But we did press the issue multiple times and we even asked point-blank ‘So are you guys stating that pastor Alistair Begg is standing by his original comment? He has no regrets? He didn’t misspeak? He doesn’t want to further clarify nothing?
And they said ‘yes, he’s standing by his original comment.'”
The hosts lamented Begg’s response.
So very disappointing. And you know I even told… the gentleman and lady that we were on the call with with Truth for Life, that pastor Alistair Begg has such a long, decades long track record of biblical fidelity and truthfully teaching the Word of God, that this is extremely disappointing. This isn’t something that we saw coming. This isn’t like- some of the others Evangelical leaders that have drifted, this is not one that was on the list that we could have seen this coming.
Update! Alistair Begg Doubles Down On Attending LGBTQ Wedding, Says He’s Not Budging.
While Begg sent staffers to speak in his stead, he has yet to personally address the matters publicly or justify holding such a dangerous and theologically decrepit view. Begg’s show still airs on 1800 radio stations, and he’s slated to be a speaker at the upcoming Shepherds Conference.
For many, the last they heard from Rob Bell was in 2011. He had risen to prominence in the early 2000s, fueled by his popular NOOMA videos which kickstarted his mainstream fame, and later on with a series of books like Velvet Jesus, Sex God, and Jesus Wants To Save Christians. Imbued with a gift for speaking and a propensity to
write things
deep things
in this style
he gained a massive following before social media really took off. He founded Mars Hill Bible Church in 1999, and within two years it had grown to one of the biggest churches in America, averaging almost 10,000 each service and making him a sought-after speaker. He was a rockstar in Evangelical circles whose materials were a mainstay for mainline youth groups. Seen as a thought leader and a key player in the emergent church, it was believed that his influence would only grow.
He was also fodder for nascent discernment ministries who took some early potshots at him for aberrant theology. They would point to a throwaway line in Velvet Elvis where Rob Bell said that the virgin birth wasn’t that important, or the vagueness in which he spoke of the gospel and Jesus’ death on the cross, and hold these words up to scrutiny as proof he was unorthodox. Still, there was never enough to convince most people that he was dangerous. His words weren’t great, but they were no smoking gun for the masses to see. He was just too vague and a little too nebulous that his defenders cried foul, dismissed the critics, and nothing really stuck.
Then, at the height of his fame, he released a book in March of 2011 titled Love Wins, which served as a full-throated defense of Universalism. The book argued that in the end, all people are ultimately saved because God is love and “love wins.”
The release of this book finally served as a big flashing light to many who were either ignorant of Rob Bell’s beliefs or who had been wary of labeling him a heretic and continued to view him as a brother, being regarded as possibly a bit of provocateur, but our provocateur. They were able to explain away and needlessly give him the benefit of the doubt for many things he said, but this was one step too far. It made national news and was the talk of Christendom for weeks, prompting John Piper to infamously tweet “Farewell Rob Bell” as Rob was cast out of the kingdom.
To get an idea of the cultural impact this book wrought, In June 2011, Time Magazine named Rob Bell as one of the Top 100 most influential people in the world. Due to the book’s release, he became even more famous for a season, but it also had dire consequences at home.
A lot of his congregants supported him, but many did not. Before his book launch, Mars Hill had 10,000 attendees over two services on a Sunday morning. By the time he stepped down in September, six months after the book’s release and after months of hemorrhaging people, attendance had dropped 65% to less than 3500 people. His last day was January 8th, 2012, and after that, he vanished off the face of the earth.
For a while
But what has Rob Bell been doing since?
He moved his family out of Michigan and to the West Coast. Making his home in Los Angeles, he has kept busy within the entertainment industry, becoming more and more forceful in his heretical beliefs and spreading forth his profanation far and wide without the constraints of his local church to more or less keep him in line.
In 2013, he was interviewed by Oprah for her Super Soul Sunday television program about his new book What We Talk About When We Talk About God, which she recommended to her “Book of the Month” club. Bonding over similar spiritual beliefs, he went on the road with her in 2014 on The Life You Want tour, gaining even more exposure and speaking on vaguely spiritual things with a distinct new-age feel. He mentioned God on occasion, but nothing that resembled biblical Christianity, which would have been an affront to Orpah’s audience.
More to his degeneration, whereas before he stepped down from the pastorate he had been vague and coy on questions of biblical sexual ethics when asked by interviewers, Rob Bell came out openly in favor and acceptance of same-sex marriage in 2013. He spoke favorably of it during his 2014 book tour, “The Zimzum Of Love,” and likewise when appearing again with Oprah in 2015 during an interview, saying
“One of the oldest aches in the bones of humanity is loneliness. Loneliness is not good for the world. Whoever you are, gay or straight, it is totally normal, natural and healthy to want someone to go through life with. It’s central to our humanity. We want someone to go on the journey with.
I think culture is already there and the church will continue to be even more irrelevant when it quotes letters from 2,000 years ago as their best defense, when you have in front of you flesh-and-blood people who are your brothers and sisters, and aunts and uncles, and co-workers and neighbors, and they love each other and just want to go through life.”
In 2015, he started The Robcast, a podcast with over 350 episodes of occasionally spiritualish stuff that is still going to this day. (He might interview a rabbi one day and then talk to a celebrity about anxiety another day). He toured extensively all over the world- France, Germany, the Netherlands, the UK, – visiting these countries and doing workshops, speaking at events, and teaching people how to be creative.
On top of devolving into a mass of liberal, progressive new-ageism, one of the most prominent targets and themes of all his projects is the idea that the Bible is “literary, but not literal.” To put it more bluntly, he regards the scriptures as bovine scatology.
He released a book in May 2017, “What Is the Bible?: How an Ancient Library of Poems, Letters, and Stories Can Transform the Way You Think and Feel About Everything to explain the scriptures to those confused by it. Gary Gilley does a great job of laying out several of Rob Bell’s theological convictions regarding the sacred texts:
“Probably the main message drawn from What Is the Bible? Is that the Bible is a thoroughly human book. It “is not a Christian book”; it “is a book about what it means to be human” (p. 4). It is not about Jesus and a narrow way to God (p. 16). Rather the Bible is a book produced purely by people sans any direct revelation from God (pp. 116-117, 188, 243-246, 266-267, 291, 295-296).
As a result, the Bible has all the problems, errors, contradictions, and wrong values that can be found in any human literature: “The Bible was written by people. People with perspectives, grounded in their cultures and times and places” (p. 243). Thus “God didn’t set up the sacrificial system. People did” (p. 244).
Further, in a 2017 interview with Lewis Howes, Rob Bell insisted that Jesus came to earth: “to wake us up and remind us of the shared humanity- the brother and sisterness of all of us.” On his belief of what the Bible is and how we should view it:
“The Bible has caused so much damage. In many ways it has often been an agent of dragging everything backwards, and it hasn’t participated in the ongoing evolution of humanity. It’s been a voice for primitive, outdated, violent, barbaric forces.”
At this point, much evidence suggests that he doesn’t even believe in a literal resurrection. Given that he has continued to twist the meaning of words, it’s hard to pin him down, but you get the impression that he doesn’t believe the literal resurrection of Jesus is a thing. He writes in his book:
“He’s alive? (Interesting that the people who were closest to Jesus and spent years with him don’t recognize him post-resurrection. Hmmm. The next time you hear someone insisting that it was an actual, literal resurrection, make sure you add that bodily must mean that he didn’t look like he looked before.)” What Is the Bible? (pp. 184-185).
In 2018, filmmaker Andrew Morgan released a film on the life and work of Rob Bell entitled “The Heretic.” The documentary goes behind the scenes of what he’s been up to and what it’s like to be him these past few years, filled with Rob Bell waxing eloquent on this piece of theology or that. It’s supposed to be about what he believes and the Christian faith, but there is scarcely anything faithful present. As the film winds down, Andrew asks Rob Bell what’s the ONE THING he wants people to know, and Rob says, instead of giving the gospel or speaking of the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus, “What the modern world does is cut you off from depth, from fullness. The truth is everything you are working and striving for, you already have. So often, we’re working, grasping, striving to feel worthy enough when the good news is waiting for you that ‘You are loved.’
In 2019, he continued touring and doing more workshops and speaking events, between 30-40 shows a year. That year, he went on his “Introduction to Joy” tour, which took him across America and overseas all throughout the UK. He’s been on Oprah’s Super Soul Sunday several times over the past few years, doling out Rob Bellisms to an eager audience. He also has a residency at The Largo- a comedy club in L.A., where he performs frequently. As to what those shows look like, a typical one might be, “I’ll talk on the soul and curiosity and risk and the power of framing language and a bit about something I saw at my cousin’s house.” Sounds scintillating.
In 2020 he toured with Elizabeth Gilbert, author of the book Eat Pray Love. Their workshop, which they continue to this day, cost almost 1200$. He made monthly appearances at The Largo and did his routine there, including a play he wrote. He had several two-day workshops lined up this summer under the “Something to Say” moniker, which is “about being creative and getting unstuck from your way of thinking at the low cost of 750$ a person.” He also wrote the book ‘Everything Is Spiritual: Finding Your Way in a Turbulent World,‘ which is part memoir,’ part riffing on his pet theologies while explaining how and why he deconstructed to them.
In 2021 he mostly stayed inside and offered writing courses and classes during COVID.
In 2022, he released the book What’s a Knucka?which is one of his plays published in book form. He also toured across the world advertising his Everything is Spiritual book and giving little talks on it.
In 2023, he released a sci-fi book called ‘Where’s To Park Your Spaceship’ about a man named Heen Gru-Bares “traveling from planet to planet collecting data and filing reports” until he meets Dill Tudd, which changes his life. This novel is quintessential Rob Bell, particularly in how it reads:
He also started to do more art, putting on a gallery of his creations:
In 2024, he’s kicking the year off hosting “2 Days in Ojai“. He explains this process, which costs $600:
You bring whatever question you have about what you’re creating, making, saying, working on, etc. and on the first day at 9am the first person sits across from me and tells me their question and then I ask you questions about your question and we go from there as you begin to see your next step…helping each other make a new world together.”
He also continues the Robcast, but as you can see, it’s a little strange:
As to Rob Bell’s trajectory and what the future has in store for him, we’re thankful his influence has waned and flamed out within the mainstream Christian church. He’s growing more and more emboldened, and we’re thankful that boldness has difficulty taking root in the lives of true believers, given he’s long been exposed for the God-hating, Christ-despising, Holy-Spirit blaspheming pagan that he is.
Venue Church used to be among the fastest-growing churches in the nation, topping 1500 people spread across four services and two locations. Then the pastor and senior leader, Tavner Smith, cheated on his wife, divorced her, and subsequently had an illicit affair with his worship leader/ personal assistant, resulting in a mass exodus of staff and congregants.
How bad is it? Based on a video from their church service yesterday, attendance is down an estimated 95%. While the church’s YouTube channel is careful only to show Taver preaching, whoever controlled the stream made a rare misstep and shared the church sanctuary before the service, revealing how bare and stark it is. There are huge gaps between the chairs, between the rows, and the center aisle is practically a chasm, with scarcely two dozen people.
This video is only a couple of minutes before their Sept 18 service started. It's a ghost town. pic.twitter.com/rTgkS8pHXI
With the church hemorrhaging money, owing creditors at least 130k, having no cash reserves, and defaulting on their rent for months, they declared bankruptcy several weeks ago in an attempt to hang on to their building at least, which was vision-casted by Smith in happier times.
This is unlikely to happen. Another thriving church, Rockpointe, is looking to expand, announcing to their congregation that they are still seeking to purchase the property and take it over, working with banks, lawyers, and real estate agents to pry the facilities out of the cold, begrudging hands of the disgraced pastor who has no path forward other than to sell.
Christians disagree—hopefully charitably—about pronoun usage. Some think that as a personal courtesy, you should refer to a transgender person by their preferred pronoun. Others think that it is wrong to inject further confusion into a person’s situation by referring to them with a pronoun that is not aligned with their biological sex. In other words, there is a spectrum of generosity of spirit vs. telling truth. I tend toward generosity of spirit.” JD Greear. 2019.
In a recent podcast, former SBC president J.D Greear has rejiggered some controversial public statements he’s made in the past, walking back earlier assertions affirming that Christian should use personal pronouns and mostly taking a much bolder stance.
Previously, Greear argue for a ‘generosity of spirit‘ when it came to the topic, quoting favorably Preston Sprinkles acceptance and urging of ‘pronoun hospitality’ in light of how the bible appears to use accommodating language. Now, things are much different.
I want to clarify some things that I said, some things that have been passed around since that podcast, partly because the conversation in our culture, has shifted, it’s evolved. I mean this is a rapidly changing thing….So my own thinking on this has crystallized and I would say, in some ways matured or, you know, evolved...
There are several dynamics at play. I think when we think about a question like this, ‘should we use somebody else’s pronouns when they they ask’ one of those is truth. Our job as witnesses to stand uncompromisingly in the truth, to rebuke our society, to stand against untruth and darkness. The other thing are the relational aspects of just knowing somebody, walking with them, maintaining a relationship with them. And we’re not just called to defend truth, we’re called to win people.
So you know, if somebody has transitioned, if Tommy, you know, now wants to go by Tara and wants to be called she/ her instead of he/him, should you consent to that go along with it? Let me actually use a phrase I first heard from Andrew Walker, because I really liked this framing. The answer to that question begins and ends with ‘no’. And the reason I say that is because I think as believers, we have to be crystal clear on the truth. So the answer begins and ends with ‘no’, that we should not use someone’s preferred pronouns when we know that Tommy is a male, because that’s how God created him.
He continues:
“I mean 1 Corinthians 6:9 makes that clear that people who embrace gender confusion and celebrate it and go along with that, I mean it says they will not inherit the kingdom of God. And I don’t know how that could get any clearer. Romans 1, Paul tells us that pursuing this kind of lifestyle not only brings the wrath of God, it’s evidence of the wrath of God. God gave people up over to this kind of stuff to not recognize and submit to the gender that God wrote into your cell structure at birth. Paul says in Romans 1 that is a rebellion against the creator of the highest order. I know there’s a lot of brokenness. I know there’s a lot of you know, dysphoria. I understand that for some people, there’s, there’s a lot of complexity and mess. But I think we have to be honest about what the Bible says about it. And we got to be clear.
In the previous ask me anything, I was hypothesizing about a situation where I’m sitting in my office …and I’m with a dad and his transgender child as they come to me for clarity on what the Bible teaches. So I make clear to them what the Bible teaches. But if in the course of conversation, in order to keep that conversation moving along, I use the child’s self referential pronouns, I talk with and about them, just to keep them in the conversation, I don’t think if someone chose to do that, that that would represent a capitulation or a compromise of truth, if on the front end and back end that’d been made clear.
But that should never be done in a way that implies acceptance or affirmation, not even for a second. The easiest thing honestly in this, because, you know, I don’t want to even normalize the way they’re thinking of themselves, the easiest way is just to use their name, even if it’s awkward.
Greear explains that every time it comes time to use pronoun, he’d just avoid it and use ‘her’ name ‘Tara’ instead, noting that “that’s a little wooden and awkward…but that awkwardness is really on them because they created the situation.”
I can show respect for them, while not affirming something that I know to be false. Again…what we’re trying to do is, we’re trying to balance two things. One, clearly testify to the truth. And then number two, doing our best to keep the person in relationship in order to keep things moving, to be able to really engage this issue at the heart level, where it has to be engaged .
…So let me add a third to that….the third one is to fight the battle at the right location. This being clear and truthful about gender, that’s a battle we have to fight, no matter how unpopular it is in our day. But that doesn’t mean that I fire shots or draw battle lines in every other sentence. You know, when I’m trying to get the conversation focused on what we need to get focused on.“
Lastly, Greear is asked what should someone do if put in a situation where he is asked to present or give his pronouns, such as for work:
“For me to clarify what my pronouns are, I’m normalizing the question. And we believe that that’s not even a valid question. And so when I point out my pronouns, in one way is I’m making a true statement. But another way, I’m normalizing a question that should not be normalized in our culture. Because we believe that the pronouns you have are what God wrote into your cell structure when you were born. So for that reason, I would resist., I would resist giving my pronouns wherever I could, because I don’t want to normalize the gender confusion, or affirm that this is a legitimate question.”
Credit where credit is due. It’s good that Greear has changed his mind on this, and we wanted to offer a full transcript for all the times we beat him up for his previous perspectives. While we’re on the topic, here’s a couple more things Greear can change and “crystalize’ his thinking on.
Prominent Christian leader Preston Sprinkle shared an Instagram post about the Matt Chandler situation yesterday, claiming that he’s spoken to the suspended pastor and the situation is overblown.
In the post, Sprinkle, who is the President of the Center for Faith, Sexuality and Gender, on the Revoice Advisory Council, is a New York Times bestselling author, and host of Theology in the Raw podcast, reveals he’s spoken to his friend twice about what’s happened, along with a long-term employee of the church, and that the church’s language suggests a far more severe offense than occurred. He alleges that the “coarse joking” was not sexual at all but involved joking about alcohol.
Furthermore, he explains that the woman Chandler was DMing was not offended by their banter, does not consider herself a victim, and urged Matt not to apologize. Preston alleges that the woman who confronted Chandler followed a particularly strict interpretation of the Billy Graham rule that precluded these conversations- an interpretation neither Chandler nor his messaging partner held.
Lastly, Sprinkle claims that the results of the investigation by the lawyers into his phone and tablet came back clean, with no porn, sexual messaging, or otherwise inappropriate conversations found anywhere on Chandler’s computers or electronic devices.
Hey Friends,
I just wanted everyone to know that I’ve looked extensively into all the stuff involving Matt Chandler on the Village Church. I’ve talked to Matt twice and talked to a woman who’s been on staff at the church for over 18 years. I can’t share private details, but I will say that so much of the way the popular media (secular and even Christian) is portraying it is pretty bad and even the church’s messaging framed it in some pretty negative terms that could be misconstrued. The “coarse joking” was jokes about alcohol (not sexual innuendo or lewd jokes) and the big issue was that his DM relationship seemed too “familiar” for someone that he didn’t know terribly well in person. He basically violated the Billy Graham rule.
To be clear, the woman he was messaging wasn’t at all offended and told Matt “don’t you dare apologize; you did nothing wrong!” It was the woman’s friend, who lives by a very strict Billy Graham type of rule, that was offended that Matt was DMing a married woman (even though Matt’s wife and the woman’s husband was fully aware of it)
An independent org scoured his electronics and found no porn and no other inappropriate or romantic sort of messaging.
All this to say, I have no problem still having Matt speak at the Exiles conference this year. I mean, if we applied the same standard to all the speakers, I’m not sure I’d be able to have any speakers at the conference.
Honestly, this whole thing gas made me want to re-integrate the Billy Graham rule into my own life. People give me a hard time because I do try to be extra vigilant in keeping my relationship with other women much more cautious, but I’ve been thinking maybe I should be more friendly and jovial. But it(sic) situations like Matt’s that make me more nervous about this. But, I’ve gotta run.
Weeks after Venue Church ‘pastor’ Tavner Smith addressed rumors surrounding the foreclosure and sale of their property, the result of hemorrhaging members and money for nearly a year after he was exposed for carrying on an illicit affair with his worship leader/ personal assistant, the church has filed for bankruptcy in a desperate bid to fend off foreclosure of their building.
The megachurch at 6401 Lee Highway, which was named one of the fastest growing churches in America by Outreach Magazine and LifeWay Research in 2015, filed a Chapter 11 petition in U.S. Bankruptcy Court in Chattanooga on Tuesday to reorganize its finances under court protection. The bankruptcy filing will help stave off a foreclosure that was scheduled later this month on the nearly 47,000-square-foot building that houses the 7-year-old church.
In its bankruptcy filing, the church said its revenues dropped from more than $3.1 million in 2020 to just over $2 million last year and are on pace to be under $1 million this year.
Venue Church listed debts and other creditor claims of more than $3 million. But the church estimates its property is worth $4.5 million.
The church’s bankruptcy attorney states that the Venue Church “intends to pay off all of its creditors in full.”
Venue Church used to be among the fastest-growing churches in the nation, topping 1500 people spread across four services and two locations. Now, they’re lucky to get a few dozen people.
Most of the church staff quit last year after Smith and his paramour were spotted in a video kissing and were caught in a compromising situation involving a bowl of chili and some boxer briefs. After the news came out, Smith took a month or so off for personal reflection and healing and then was back in the saddle again.
Venue Church ‘pastor’ Tavner Smith spent several minutes during yesterday’s church service addressing the rumors surrounding the foreclosure and sale of their property. The church, led by the ‘WISH’ version of Steven Furtick, has been hemorrhaging members and money for nearly a year after being exposed for carrying on an illicit affair with his worship leader/ personal assistant.
Pastor Smith and worship leader Lexi were filmed sharing a kiss and were caught in a compromising situation involving a bowl of chili and some boxer briefs. With his wife divorcing him on account of ‘extramarital relations’ and most members of his church leadership team quitting, Smith took six weeks off personal reflection and healing and then was back in the saddle again, only to far fewer people.
Venue Church used to be among the fastest-growing churches in the nation, at one point topping 1500 people spread across four services and two locations. Now, they’re running anywhere between 90-120 people at one location, by the last estimate.
Five days ago, when news of the impending foreclosure and sale was made public, that the building was being sold and the church shut down, Smith took to social media to deny the claims, writing on Instagram: “I wanted to say it’s absolutely not true. Venue church is not shutting down. Number two, our legal team, who is amazing, has assured me that I can tell you with confidence, our Chattanooga location is going nowhere” and said he would address it at the next service. And he did, sorta.
Addressing what sounds to be a less-than-enthusiastic crowd, he begins the spin, admitting that the church is in a tough spot but that even if they lose the building, they’ll just gather at his house because the church isn’t a building- they are. He explains:
Before I jump into my message, I would just like to briefly address the mess, address everything that’s been going on that maybe you’ve seen on social media, or read or heard or seen comments and those type of things. I wanted you to hear from your pastor, personally.
You probably read in the paper saw in the paper that the bank put a notice of foreclosure on our building. Which is absolutely true.We’ve gone through a hard season, it’s been no lie, we we’ve not hidden that. It’s been pretty public, the season that we’ve gone through as a church. And we have had hard times and fallen on hard times. And we’ve done our best, not just as a staff, but as a whole church we’ve all come together.
Tavner at no point mentions the reason they’ve lost 95% of their congregants is because the scandal that erupted from him cheating on his wife and then refusing to step down from the pastorate like a man.
And I just want to applaud and celebrate your generosity, your faithfulness, your kindness, your patience, your willingness, and just say ‘thank you’. It is a scary situation when you’re navigating through things like this, and you know you’re not just going through it alone, but you’re going through it with a group of people, that affects lots of people.
And so when we found out and saw the notice, just like you, we were scared as well. But we also knew that God’s not done with us. Are you with me? The Bible says it this way, it says that ‘you can know the truth and the truth will set you free’. I’ve always said it this way, there’s a difference between facts and truth. Facts happen. Truth prevails.
Here’s some facts and truth: the reason that giving and attendance is down is because he is shameless in his sin and disobedience.
And I just prayed and the Lord gave us wisdom to seek some really amazing legal counsel and they’ve really helped us and they’ve, I just wanted to tell you that you don’t have to go home and you don’t have to worry, number one I just wanted to say it this way; that Venue Church, we are a church no matter what. Are you with me?
If we walked in tomorrow, and an earthquake happened and this building was swallowed up and gone, we’re still a church. The church is not a building, never was a building, never will be a building. Are you with me? We are the church. All right?
If y’all got to all come to my house will pile in there, In the cul de sac down the street, wherever we go, we are a church, but that’s not where we stand. We’ve sought our legal counsel, and they have assured me that I can stand up here and tell you that there are multiple options that they are providing for us to stay here and make it through. And I’m excited about that.
Tavner concludes this portion by saying that when he said the church was “debt-free,” what he actually meant was that they did not take on debt to renovate the church, even though they did sign a lease, and then years later and bought the building, at which point they took on good debt. At no point does he explain how they will get out of the foreclosure or why they haven’t been paying their bills for months.
The second thing I just wanted to address, and I’m not going to spend my whole time talking through this, I’ve really got a word from God for us today about our next season. But what I really wanted to address secondly was the thought out there that’s going around that I claimed we were debt free, and we really had a mortgage, I just wanted to clear that up.
Because I want you to know that your finances are cared for so much with the utmost integrity at this church. I did say in 2017, through the Promise Campaign, I stood on the stage and I said “let’s celebrate, we are debt free, we did this debt free”, because at that time we were 100% debt free through the Promise Campaign.
And I don’t know if some of you were here or not, but just to catch you up; that was a that was a giving campaign when we got this building. We didn’t buy it at the beginning, we leased it. Okay? We didn’t have the ability to buy it when we first came here, but we signed a lease to be here. We didn’t know if we were going to be able to buy it, and that was a lot of money to put in and go get financed for to renovate a building that you hope you’re gonna stay in and believe you’re gonna stay in, but you’re just leasing it and you don’t own it.
So we felt like the Lord said, ‘raise the money’ and whatever amount you raise, that’s what you put in to do the renovations to remain debt free on the renovations. So we did. We took up all of that money and debt free, we renovated this entire building. And when I made that announcement, we didn’t have a mortgage. We didn’t own this building. We leased this building, and we were debt free through our renovations. It was a true, honest celebration, it was where we were.
It wasn’t until two years later that we got an amazing opportunity. We got an opportunity that when we leased the building, we leased 38,000 square feet. But we got an opportunity to buy not only that 38,000 square feet, but 10,000 extra square feet next door and five acres of land, and in purchasing that save over $5,000 a month in payments.
So our board, every one of them approved that, signed off on that, we purchased this land, and I just want to celebrate right now that we’re not renters anymore, we’re owners of this entire property. And so now we do have debt. But it’s been a good debt. It’s actually saved us a lot of money in seasons where we were able to give that money away to ministries nationally, internationally and locally and help families and people right here in the community just like we still do every single day.
That dirty business done, Tavner preaches a sermon telling the congregants that God gave him a word, that the Lord wants to take their foreclosure and use it ‘for closure.’ That the time is now “for closure” on all the areas that have divided the church and caused disunity, putting them to bed and burying them for good. He intones, “without closure, we’re in chaos” and “there has to be closure of an old season and the beginning of a new season. Nobody wants it to be summer all year round.”
By ‘closure,’ we can only assume he wants people to stop talking about his deep and abiding sexual sin and his refusal to repent and make it right.
No, there will be no such “closure” for a man such as this.
Dallas Jenkins, son of “Left Behind” author Jerry Jenkins, and Director of the smash-hit TV show The Chosen continued to double down on controversial comments he made last year about Mormons (Latter Day Saints, ie LDS) and Jesus loving the same Jesus, appearing on Ruslan KD’s channel and against insisting that some of his Mormon friends indeed have and love the same Jesus as he does, while engaging in a bit of revisionist history over what he actually did say.
For a brief overview of the Mormon views on Jesus and other things, they believe that Jesus was once a regular sinful man who became exalted and turned into a God after doing many good deeds. ‘God the Father’ himself was also once a man on another planet, but because he likewise was such a good Mormon, he was granted the right to become a God over this earth. They believe that they too can become capital ‘G’ Gods of their own planet one day, and in fact, hold that there are millions of Gods. For them, the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are all and individual separate Gods, and they all have human bodies of flesh- they are not Spirits.
Mormons categorically deny the idea of salvation by grace alone and believe Jesus and Lucifer are ‘spirit brothers.’ They believe the scriptures we have are all corrupted and that’s why they have the new revelation of Joseph Smith.
Jenkins tells Ruslan (who really should do better prep when he has controversial figures on. We offer our archives as a great resource so he doesn’t keep on getting lied to by his guests)
And one of the things that I have said in the past that caused the most controversy was I was referring to a few LDS folks that I’m partnered with, that I know, and I said, “we love the same Jesus”. And a lot of people have taken that out of context and quoted me as saying, ‘Dallas Jenkins says that all Mormons are Christians’ or ‘[All Mormons] believe the same Jesus’. I’ve made it clear… I don’t speak for any group of people. I was speaking for a few friends that I have, a couple of my partners, I stand by the statement, and I don’t speak for an entire LDS or Catholic Church, just like I wouldn’t speak for the entire evangelical church.”
He goes on to say that there are two reasons why he doesn’t discuss publicly what Mormons believe or comment on the truth and accuracy of the Mormon gospel, suggesting that in the same way that evangelical Christians believe some of the wrong things within their faith, so do Mormons or Jehovah Witnesses, as if a different view on infant baptism or women preaching is comparable to the notion that God the father once being a sinful human who became a God and then had sex billions of times with his celestial wife in order to populate the earth with spirit babies.
“…I believe that my job as the creator of The Chosen, in this context, publicly, is to point people to the authentic Jesus, point people to Scripture and to the real thing as much as humanly possible. And so that if you spot a quote, unquote, counterfeit gospel, or counterfeit Jesus, that you will know it immediately.
And that brings me to my second point, which is that I don’t believe that LDS or Catholic or Greek Orthodox or Jehovah’s Witness, have a monopoly on people as part of their faith traditions, who believe in the wrong thing. I believe in the evangelical faith, I believe… in my own churches I have sat next to people who believe some of the wrong things.
I have, and probably currently do have a few things that I’m getting wrong. And so my job in my in with the show, and also, I think, even in my personal relationships, is as much as possible to to evangelise to everybody. So…there’s no win for me in taking time to go through each of the different faith traditions, and try to point out all the different things that I disagree with….’ll let the Holy Spirit and I’ll let the discipleship of the local church do the job of nuancing all of those kind of large scale or even small scale disagreements.”
Here’s the thing. Even if he wasn’t explicitly referring to the LDS community, which he was, unless his Mormon friends repudiate basically everything they believe about Jesus, then he is still wrong that his Mormon friends and partners believe in the same Jesus. Even if we were to grant his contention he’s not talking about ‘all Mormons,’ it doesn’t make it any better that he still believe that these specific Mormons love the same Jesus.
But the comments he is referring to that got him in such hot water are from a May 29, 2020 upload on the Mormon Show Saints Unscripted, where he originally said:
One of the most interesting things about this whole project has been my relationship with different denominational or faith traditions that I didn’t have before. I’ve learned so much more about the LDS community than I thought I knew.
…And what’s funny about the LDS folks as you guys seem to be, even though you’re the most controversial, you seem to be the least confrontational. It’s just like, ‘hey, we all love Jesus. I just want to let you know, we love the show’. And when people start going, ‘Hey, you’re a Mormon, you’re going to hell’. You just like, ‘hey, whatever.” It’s like it just kind of seems to roll off your back. Maybe it’s because you’re used to being on the outside sometimes.
…So even if I had significant disagreements with the LDS community, which I’ve learned, I have fewer than I thought I did. But even with that, I was okay, I was comfortable with that, because as long as they’re treating the show properly, that’s all that matters. So I can honestly say it’s been one of the top three most fascinating and beautiful things about this project has been my growing brother and sisterhood with people of the LDS community that I never would have known otherwise.
I’m learning so much about your faith tradition, and realizing, gosh, for all the stuff that maybe we don’t see eye to eye on, that all happened, that’s all based on stuff that happened after Jesus was here.
The stories of Jesus, we do agree on and we love the same Jesus. That’s not something that you often hear. Sometimes it’s like, ‘oh, they believe in a different Jesus that we do.’
Host: “that’s a controversial statement. ”
Yeah. No, it’s the same. I mean, I’ll sink or swim on that statement, and it’s controversial, and I don’t mind getting criticized at all for the show, and I don’t mind being called a blasphemer. I don’t like it when my (LDS) friends are.
And I made it very clear that if I go down, I’m going down swinging, protecting my friends, and my brothers and sisters. And so I don’t deny we have a lot of theological differences, but we love the same Jesus.”
On the Mormon podcast 'Saints Unscripted' Dallas Jenkins laments that Latter Day Saints have a poor reputation with evangelicals, and gets real explicit about how much he and Mormons love the same Jesus. https://t.co/7vUsh5iStPpic.twitter.com/uFLw8ED7Jg
Clearly, he’s not talking about just a few people. Lastly, here is a transcript from a previous post we did, where he routinely fails to make the delineation that he was only speaking of his specific friends and partners, but rather all Mormons.
Morgan Jones 1 “I have been told that you are a fierce defender of the Latter-day Saint belief in Jesus Christ, and that is something that honestly, on behalf of all of us, I just want to say thank you for that. But why is it that you are a defender of our belief in Jesus Christ?
Dallas Jenkins ; Great, so you’re starting off right out of the gate with that one. Well, it’s a tough question. I am happy to answer that and I just say that because I recently have gotten a little bit in trouble in certain circles because I was on another LDS podcast, and I said that LDS and evangelicals love the same Jesus. I got some heat from people who suddenly didn’t want to watch the show anymore because of that. Apparently it’s a controversial statement, which I guess I would have known that a few years ago, but now that I’ve been working with my LDS brothers and sisters over the last couple of years and gotten to know them so well, I’ve learned quite a bit. I come from a strong evangelical background, and I want to say this, and I’ve said this in a few conversations with LDS people, that there are reasons why I’m an evangelical and not LDS. I do have things theologically that I disagree with or things that even just in kind of practice that aren’t quite my speed in the LDS faith. However, one thing that is unabashedly true and unarguably true is that in getting to know some of my LDS friends here on this, especially through “The Chosen,” you’re passionate about Jesus Christ, and it’s Jesus of Nazareth. When I hear people say, “it’s a different Jesus”—and I’ve heard that, by the way, from both… I don’t know what term, I know you guys don’t use the term Mormon anymore, but it’s too long for me to try to say…
and
So even if you are listening to this right now as an evangelical and are horrified to hear me say some of these things, consider that even if you disagree, even if you think that, “No, it’s two different Jesus’s, and they worship two different Saviors, and what you’re saying is wrong.” Fine, believe what you will. I’m not gonna have these arguments with you…I don’t like it when my friends get attacked. So that’s why I tend to be pretty defensive of my friends, even if not always defensive of the theology on which we sometimes disagree...I don’t really care because I can’t be cancelled unless I cancel myself. So I’m totally fine with it. But I’m happy to say, “Yeah, we disagree on some things, but I’m going to die on the hill of, we love the same Jesus, and we want the same Jesus known to the world.”
